What does the gig economy mean for your business
What, the gig economy means, for your business this. Term the gig economy is, something that seems to be popping up all the time right now and if you do a Google search you'll, find something like twenty three and a half million. Results. So, that's an indicator that something, big is happening right now with, the way that work is being organized, and, we're going to take a look and find out what the gig economy is, what. Are the challenges for small to medium-sized, businesses in. The gig economy what. Technology, is here or coming and what are the legal challenges, I'm. Allison, Williams managing. Editor at HR advanced I'm in charge of the knowledge center where we keep you up to date for the with the latest information affecting. Your workplace these. Webinars are just one way we provide you with information we. Also have articles, and video Oh, a ebooks infographics. You can log on to HR advance and click on the knowledge center from, the home page and you'll get answers to a lot of your common workplace issues, now. I have with me two guest, speakers today you'll. First be hearing from Anna Samuels, who is a business, advisor with the federal government's entrepreneurs, program Anna works. With and mentors, businesses. Of all different sizes are, particularly medium-sized, businesses, she's. A certified Gizelle's, international, coach and she's also run her own business so welcome Anna thank you and. Also. With me today is Michael Rocha and Michael. Is senior, associate, with Australian, business lawyers and advisors who, of course you know is the legal team behind HR, advance. Michael. Practices, in, employment, industrial, and workplace relations law and he provides strategic, and, practical, advice to clients in. A whole area. Of different. Businesses, manufacturing. Pharmaceutical. Healthcare, retail transport. I could, go on my solution. Okay. So welcome Mike thank you very much, so. I'm going to. Ask. You to just clarify what, exactly is the, gig economy. Thank. You it's. I guess it's a way of working. That is based on people having temporary, jobs or doing separate pieces of work each paid, separately, rather, than working for one single employer. Look big economy is continuing to boom across a variety of industries according, to the ABS we, have about two and a half million Australians. Employed. On a casual, basis, which is more than a quarter of our workforce, now almost. Doubling from the 1990s. In fairness. The. Concept. Isn't a new one businesses. Have been operating, in a gig economy for, a long time businesses. Of sorts bookkeepers. Accountants. IT specialist. And marketing people on an ad-hoc basis, for decades, trainees, such as plumbers and electricians have. Been using a gig economy business model since time immemorial. What. Has changed though, is the growing trend of high knowledge workers, leaving, the restrictive, nine-to-five. Desk-bound, jobs, and choosing. To work on their own terms in an environment, of their choice so what's. Caused this change I, guess, the biggest cause of the change has been the evolution of this device, we now have which is a combination. Of if you're old enough to remember, walkman. Telephone, letter box and a global, library all wrapped, up in a device called a mobile phone or a laptop and this. Is really empowered, traditional, desktop, our disband employees. With, them the physical freedom that was never possible before, the. World is now affordably, hyper, connected to the nanosecond and with the delivery of 5g, on its, way and you know rolling out of the NBN, it's only going to become faster, and more dispersed. The. Gig economy has, been equally, embraced by business, owners and employees. We. Know for businesses, to remain competitive, we, need these businesses, need to be highly agile, and there. Are significant. Cost pressures, on businesses, as they compete on a global scale the two largest expenses. For often for, a business a payroll and occupancy, costs like rent how.
A Company. Spends this money relative to their competition is one, of the most important, strategic decisions. Business, owners will have to make over, the next couple of years the. Internet, has provided businesses. With a choice to remove or reduce, these, two fixed costs therefore, increasing, profitability and, the long term sustainability, in, addition. The labor market is now tighter and it's, harder for employers, attract and keep great. Full-time, employees, a same. Same salary offering, that we know in the past of 9:00 to 5:00 in the office for weeks annual leave plus a financial, bonus at the end of the year how. They lucky has. It for, a long time high, knowledge workers, these. People are looking for, challenging. Types of work and also work flexibility. The. Tight labor market coupled. With global. Competitive, pressures, have forced many businesses, to throw their two traditional, business. Model up in the air and see, these highly, disruptive times, as an opportunity, to rethink, how, their business interacts with their talent, their customer. And their suppliers. By. Tapping into an on-demand gig, workers employers can remain nimble and, cost-effective. By using gig economy platforms. That we'll look at towards, the end gig. Workers, can be dispatched, at a moment's notice receive. Notifications. That I apps and upload, completed, work it's, as simple as that. Businesses. Who collaborate, with gig workers, have added advantages, of expanding, into new markets without. The large overheads. Of full-time workers, and rent on the ground. Ok. That sounds pretty attractive actually, Ana mm-hmm, freelance, there's a lot of freelancers, really enjoy it too because we know that you know Gallup reports that over 70%, of workers aren't engaged in their jobs and. Many other studies reveal high levels of stress and dissatisfaction. Amongst employees, the. Gig economy offers. A much needed alternative. Model of work that, can supplement or, substitute. For, being a full-time employee in. A full-time job. Talented. Traditional, full-time employees, are attracted, to these flexible, working arrangements. As it, offers greater control, over their daily schedule, to, work that, you can work earlier, or later fit. It in between your social, and family commitments and. Work. In different environments as, you choose and also with a variety of tasks, new. Technologies, have made it much easier to, connect, people to. Their jobs. So. When it comes to attracting and, retaining key, people great companies, simply do whatever it takes to, keep great people happy including. Customizing. Their sensation, packages, forget. Any idea, of one rule for all the, my way or the highway leadership. Styles, are now becoming obsolete all the. Old assumptions, of what a typical business looks like and how it behaves just don't apply anymore. The. Internet has wiped the Plainfield, clean. Business. Models and organizational. Structures, are being disrupted and we, are now seeing all charts, of highly, autonomous, distributed. And empowered. Connections. General. Stanley McChrystal redesigned. The military chain of command recently. From. The traditional, top-down model into, an engaged. And empowered team, of operatives who, all share common, core values, he. Had to change his org chart in response, to years of defeat at the hand of an enemy that was highly connected using, the internet so I'm just confirming that's the US military, you're talking that's the US military, and when they went into Iraq. And also with. Afghanistan. They had to rethink how they were because they were completely, being. They. Were losing on the ground and they had to think faster of how to respond, and their best operatives, but completely, in. The. Line of fire as many, of our customer, facing. Employees. Are, an. Interesting, analogy yeah, we're, seeing all the, military and the defense have always kind of. It's. A it's, almost a leading indicator of the way things, are changing within. Structures, and organizational. Structures, hmm, I think, what's very interesting for me when I fly out over a Sydney or over any other cities is that society. Already structures, itself in a team, of teams way you know we fly over a city at nighttime and you'll see a myriad, of interconnected. Yet, independent suburbs. Or villages, or functioning. In free flow, society. Is function, like this for centuries and, companies. Structures, are making a similar transition. Companies. Are making a similar, transition also, in response to a highly engaged and more knowledgeable, customer base it's. That ability to, quickly respond. To what our customer, needs is. Really changing the way. Our org charts, are looking. Response. Times are much faster. Trust the responsibility. To deliver what, the customer, wants quickly needs to be placed in the hands of the best people who can source. Businesses. Have to, take a hard look at their traditional, organizational, structures, and decide which divisions, are required, to provide time critical, customer service, the.
Significant. Challenge for many businesses, is workflow, management time. Management. Prioritization. And tasks, Ed's and flows and contractors, availability, and these, things all need to be considered, as we're moving into employing, people with under the gig economy. So. Looking at technologies, that a lot of businesses, are using. There's. Different, methods we can use for communication, but, also for for workflow, planning. Some. Great examples. Simplest, software which is highly used by trade services, we've, got Facebook we've got a platform which, they're calling, on Facebook. Work. Workgroups. And it's, literally, like a secure. Facebook. Channel where all your employees, can. Interact. And share knowledge in. A safe environment, we've got apps like slack Yammer. And. Lots. Of project, management tools like Basecamp. And they're really effective I think. The. One that a lot of businesses try to try on first which is really, quite cheap is things, like Trello trillo's, like an electronic. Colorful. Whiteboard, it's for five dollars a month that businesses, can start to really. Work. Out what their workflow is going to be like in any priorities, that they need to set so, for. Five dollars a month the business can really, start. Using some simple technology, so can I just say, you. Know if most. People are probably familiar with, some of those names Yammer and slack but maybe they're not actually using them like they okay. I've heard of them but what's it actually going to do for the business how does it make it function, better okay, if we've got a, workforce. Which is dispersed, so we've got people in different time zones which is very common at the moment or. You have people in different locations, using. Things like slack, or Yammer can. Actually, just ease the conversation, and the knowledge share that we have so, traditionally, these things used to be a random water cooler or, in the lift or you, know as we were interacting, in. An office space these. Platforms. Allow, that to happen on a digital in. A digital way so their communication, tools certainly. Where I where, I work Australian, business lawyers and advisors with you slack for some time, we. See, it as a really good way of communicating, which is external to emails, so.
That We can just, quickly whip, out our phone talk, about something quickly we, don't need to worry about the. The strictures. Of email, you know communication, in and, it clears, up our inboxes, as well which is you know usually used for obviously. Client, work and. Things that that that a more, client. Facing slack, is a way of quickly communicating, amongst ourselves. Yeah. Now. What about I mean not obviously, zeros of having software, so, they also have project, management add-ons. They, have some really interesting apps especially for. People. Who are on the ground, so. You know being, able to geographically. Pinpoint, locations. And everything. Gets integrated with invoicing, and debtor systems, it's it's, really quite new. More what. It can do was it's been set up properly. Yeah. Have. You got any further. Slides there Anna or we are eating on to you. Taking. Questions that. Would be great so yeah do contact, us dial, in that if you've got any Content any question, so I'll just don't move along to you there Mike, off you can take that over yes certainly so, um we, first. Presented on this topic, probably. About 18, months ago and. Initially. We were sort of greeted, with what, on earth is the gig economy, and. How. Could it possibly be useful if I've never heard of it. Well, it's. Increasingly. Becoming useful it's increasingly, becoming, a part. Of a workforce mix. And. In, some industries, where you, know you're in a startup phase or, you. Know you need to quickly. Think about new areas that you might expand, into the, gig economy can, provide, that and it can actually assist quite, a lot in terms of, quickly. Flexing, up and quickly flexing, down but. It's really important that we get it right within the legal framework and. That we don't engage, in the gear kind of mean in a somewhat risky way sometimes. The laws of it's slow, to catch up with what's, happening out, there and I think certainly, with the gig economy we've, seen a, closer. Focus, by some, of the regulators with the Fair Work Ombudsman. And. And some, reasonably. High profile cases in the fit Work Commission. With. Some of the sort of household names that we think about when we think about with the geek economy so. As. We've, got on the slides. Sounds. Like a bit of a dad joke begins gigs are no longer something just that a musician gets. There. Very. Quick task. Based jobs that we can we can do through an app or, you. Know some other technology. Platforms, so I think if we looked at it air Tasker it asked us really that the most pure form of, of gig.
Economy Platform. It enables anyone to basically do anything, if. You need tiling, done in your bathroom, you can get someone to do, that for you just say I've made a tile and I'm willing to pay this much the, person can engage with you, in that way if, you're in an organization and you need some marketing materials, produced or. Something. That your company. Doesn't have the capability for, you could engage with air Tasker, to get that job done. Other. Ones on the screen fedora. We'll get into in a moment and food, delivery, service delivery. Food delivery service uber. Of. Course is that the the one, of the most well. Known and a household name companies, eighty. Billion dollars of value worldwide. According. To some, valuations, that have been undertaken. Very. Much reliant. Upon a, whole lot of. Funding. At the moment but the idea is that soon you know at some point they're not too distant future hopefully for those investors they'll. Really start to turn a very significant, profit but the. Basic, thing is that. It's especially. With air Tasker. It's. A it's a way of people, to connect. For freelancing, opportunities, some people have described, it and it's. Not always really, helpful. If we're thinking about our existing, employment, law frameworks, with, you. Know full-time work part-time work casual, work and contractors, and. That's, where we have to fit some of these things into, and. Some of these jobs into and sometimes. It's a square peg in a round hole for, what we're looking at right now and but. I. Think, in terms, of businesses, engaging air Tasker, and go. Ahead and do it but just be aware of some of the legal frameworks, that sit behind it, so. The. I. Guess the key risk that we're really concerned, about all that the key issue that we really need to think about I don't, want to be too negative about these things that I'm trying to look at the, risk areas so. We need to know who's a contractor, who's, an employee and whether, a worker provides, his. Or her services, as a contractor, or an employee is. Something that courts and tribunals look, at by looking beyond. The words that are used in the contract, and they'll really examine, the substance, of that relationship, so they'll, say um you, know okay yes you called yourself, a Pty Ltd company you, issued some investors, but, there, are some other tests that are more important, than just what you call it. So. Um, and, and it's, also important, to know that we're, we've had a particular industry operating, it as, contractors, historically, it's not always gonna answer the question and it'll be determined on a case-by-case basis. So. We'll have a look at that in, a moment the. Key case on. This. And. And, and and this evaluating. The substance, of the relationship, is one called ace insurance, and trifa Natsuki the 2013. Case full, court of the federal court of Australia and, basically. We. Look at the substance of the relationship, so, I, guess. I'll read from the decision here when, it says the, parties may agree the. Terms of their contract hi, I'm a contractor. But. Any statement, by them about the character, of the relationship, again. I'm still. Calling myself contractor. Or what's in their contract, has consistently, not been held to be decisive. Of the true legal character, of either. Of those different, types of relationships so we can have, all. The labels we want the court will actually sweep it aside if there's. A good basis, to do it and in. This case there. Were five, insurance. Sales, people employed, by a company called and combined, insurance, company. They. Would. Say they weren't employed I've probably, given away where this is going they were called contractors. And. They conducted, all of their work on a commission basis, and. They. Reported. To an employee in the company and, the court said yes, you, call yourself a PT loyal to their company yes you invoice and but. Your. Comp that company exercises, a huge degree of control over you and in fact they train you in the way that they could want you to conduct that that work they.
They. They. Don't. Allow you to subcontract, that work they don't allow you to. To. To run yourself as a business you're not entrepreneurial. In nature you're. Doing work for us and you're getting paid, for, that work and, they said. Regardless. Of the. Pty, Ltd structure. That's in the way sorry, you guys are employees, and so. What. Happened with that was obviously. The company engaging, them had an issue they had an issue about annual leave, sick, leave. Long. Service, leaves some, superannuation, issues, so all of those things are really critical, to get right now, I'm, not, saying this because air, Tasker, if you engage in a task here you're going to get found out but if you repeatedly, engaged, someone. Over. And over and over and over again and, you initially. At least did it through a tasket and then you just you just became friendly, that's. Where there might be a. Risk, and, also. It might it might just be a one-off if the person is hell-bent on making a claim but. But. Certainly if, you have a good experience on air Tasker you'll have their contact details and you probably just go forward with them in future when you need that done so. The risk is there that despite. You saying yes, they're a contractor, and they just invoice us. Or, yes, we just used the platform on a repeated basis, it. Might it might strikes me is actually a bit of a flaw in the business model for these four. Platforms such as air, taxis, that you know they rely almost an introduction, service rather than it, can be yeah it definitely can, be and air tasks is this, was kind of forward thinking it's actually signed an MoU with some unions, about. What. They would do and how they would structure those relationships. And so. Though they have been a lot more forward-thinking then, say. Deliverer. Who we'll get to in a moment, and, in some of the others whether. That was a good idea or a bad idea, only the fullness of time will tell but they've, actually, worked. On how they structure themselves with unions who are the most likely parties, to, come.
Forward Yes yeah so, um, when. We look at whether. Someone's, a contractor, or an employee there's. A there's a table on the screen, there. Which, is, incredibly, involved. But. Basically, if you're on the left-hand side more often than not you're. Overwhelmingly. Likely to be in a contracting, relationship, if, you're on the right-hand side and you're. More. Likely than not to be in an employment, situation so. On. The, left-hand side we've got things, that that, look extremely, entrepreneurial. And nature look like a business, people. Can come and go as they please they, can get the job done when they want to do it they. Can subcontract that, work out, they. Will, work. For multiple different contracting, parties, and they'll, provide their own tools they'll, be, remunerated according. To the services, and the. Goods and products that they deliver, or. Paid based as I say pays paid based on the results, and. The. Basics there of course they're not provided with annual leave and long term personal, leave they're, not NGOs. To use is paid pursuant invoices, issued so all, of those things look like a contractor. And. On the other side of the things. Other. Side of things on that on the outside of the table we've, got workers, who, who. Report, to someone who, have. Their work supervisor. - can't. Delegate, their work, that. Actually. Come. To work with the uniform on saying. Hey I'm from this company and. Represent, themselves in that way and. They. Get leave entitlements, and things like that much more likely again to be an. Employer, and the. Reason I'll, get into it in a moment about what's. More likely than not to be the case. It's. Not there's no hard and fast rule, it's it's evaluated, on a case-by-case basis. The courts will look at everything when it comes before, them they won't say this is what we did last time that's what we'll do now they'll actually look at who. Said what to whom and how what their conduct demonstrated. And. I look at this so you could have the situation where you're, literally choosing bits from both sides of the, table or the court, picks one or the other right yeah. So. It's. It's not, it's, not set in stone that's. For sure. Okay. So as, I said getting, it wrong can be a bit costly for employers. Obviously. Each. Each, time, we get it wrong and it'll. Most, likely result, in issues. About leave they'll. Probably be awards that sit behind that engagement so, the, awards, will contain penalties, and loadings and other other payments, that are required, to be paid and. Whether. A court kind. Of looks at the total amount that was paid on a pay period to pay period basis and says yes, that's okay you can set it off against all of those particular requirements, that, you didn't have, in mind or or, not will be an open question, and, so, it's. Really important to get it right so, obviously payroll, tax liabilities. Super. Requirements. All of those things are separately actionable, and. Have. Penalties. For non-compliance attached. To it if. People. Just simply it, was an oversight, they didn't knowingly or recklessly do, it then. You. Know it won't be as severe as say you know we just thought we were doing the right thing but in fact we found out that we weren't. And. Then, I guess. All that's fine if we're thinking about one person, but if we've scaled up and engaged 15, people. And. They're all they've, all got an issue then. All, of values, a is a is a problem, which multiplies, out so. By. Enlarge if you, engage someone, to do work, by. A task I just, have this in the back of your mind but it's, for sure we're engaged with these wonderful platforms. They're there to, do that that. And they do that overwhelmingly, in, the right way. So. We've. Got a slide here that is a little bit repetitive, for. What we had previously, but. I guess. These, be, these. Businesses aren't going away of course they're not they do great things. They're, here with, the exception of fedora, who's.
Actually Just, decided, to wind up, because. Of pressure they're faced about shared contracting. Which I'll get into in a moment, they're. All here and they're all going to be here for the, Airbnb. And uber ever. In their particular isn't extremely, profitable. Privately. Held company, I think ubers, got, challenges, with with them with, profitability. But certainly, those. Companies at. Least you know they seem to be here stay. In. The, UK there's. Been some some cases, about. Uber. In. Particular, we've. Had some drivers that came forward who said. That they weren't getting paid the minimum wage, and. The, employment, tribunal in, the UK at. First, instance, said. Absolutely. You guys were employees and. They, said that it was was. It faintly ridiculous. That. Ubers, documents, their contracting, and service agreements. Reported. Fictions, twisted, language and brand-new terminology, which bears no relation, to the real dealings, and relationships, between parties, it, should be read skeptically. Their designs have just represent, the relationship, and this, is it the notion of the uber is in London is a mosaic of 30,000. Businesses. Small businesses, linked by a common platform, is, to our minds faintly, ridiculous, drivers. Do not and cannot, negotiate with passengers, there are further than exceptions. Trips. Strictly, under it, was terms so. You think to yourself reading, now or, how is it possible that they do what they do and in Australia, we've actually said the opposite. So. We've said that, uber. Is not an employer. So. It's, it's a it said that my god does fair work okay. On three, occasions that's, foreign is the most the. The the. Decision. That most people point to is a, driver, called mister Casillas and he. Had his he had his account deactivated. Because of poor passenger ratings, and it was very very strict about what they do if, someone. Gets the number of bad ratings that really drastically affects him and they can have their so it's the activated. Mystic. Series brought an unfair dismissal application, and he said that he. Was an employee just, you know Fair Work Act and Hoover said no, he's not and. They. Said, that. He's. Engaged. By our services, agreement, that. He. Uses the platform, to connect with members require transportation. Services, said. Amongst other things the services, agreement provided, that, the, relationship, is one of independent, contracting, Berger. Is granting. The driver a sub license to use a partner, app, it. Provides, services, lead generation, services, buyer. It's app it. Says that they're.
Prohibited From wearing a uniform saying, they're from over. The. The. Logo and the colors. They. Don't plan it whether interestingly. Now uber cars have to label themselves as in. The back window but. They said that mystic. Cirrus had complete control over the way he conducted the services, he just came and went as he pleased and did it when he wanted to. He. Provided his own vehicle his, own phone he. Registered his own vehicle the insurance, was paid for by himself. Mystic, Cirrus registered, for tax he had to remain all his tax liability. And that. The, tax. Office requires, variety. Hring drivers to obtain an ABN and register for any, GST, and. Claim, GST, credits, for only. Transporting, passengers and. Interestingly. Mr.. Sarah said that if he was truly an independent, contractor, he would be able to charge a lower or higher fare, whereas. The services agreement only permitted, him to charge lower fare and. Deputy, president accepted, that this was a relevant fact until like they said in the UK and. He was really pointing, to the UK decision, it's but. This, was outweighed by the other factors, so, if we go back to that table, which. Is a bit of a table of death. You. Know they're gonna make a call one way or the other there's no hard and fast rule, and that's why it's quite uncertain. Now. In. The case of fedora. If. Being. Targeted. By the Fair Work Ombudsman, for. Sham, and contracting, which is different. This isn't just oh we, didn't realize we were doing the wrong thing they've. Made the allegations, that their delivery drivers were inappropriately, engaged as contractors, and they knew that it was the wrong thing to do. So. That's, a. Little bit if. Obviously has, very high penalties, that apply to it it requires. Knowing. Or recklessly, indifferent, behavior. It. And. And. I can I can say, with a reasonable amount of certainty if you go into air Town Square and get someone to do something I think. It would be a long draught, long. Photo drawer to, say that you're. Engaging in sham contracting. Unless. There was some communication. Between yourself, or the person you were talking to about, whether they should get leave entitlements, and we. Had some specialist, knowledge or understanding that, the fact that that they should they shouldn't, and all. That. They sure and that you said no in no circumstances. Should they to, give it under to give you a real understanding I guess. That. The the a. Sham. Contracting, arrangement, can sometimes involve convincing, an employee to become an independent contract, when, the job paper has. Not changed, any particular way when. They dismiss. Or threaten to dismiss a person, if. They don't agree to become an independent contractor. Or. Dismisses. And dismisses. Them and rehire them as an independent contractor to do the same job so, it really requires a you. Know a special. Kind of behavior, that gets you there and. The really important thing for people to be aware of if they're thinking I might. Have done this or. I'm thinking this might just be a bit easier if. We. Just forgot, about a Fair Work Act and we just engage people, as contractors, because I can't be bothered with the paperwork, I don't have to pay people as much or, you, know it's, not it's not as rigorous as a normal, employment relationship, there's less stress, well. There's a reverse burden of proof here and, people, need to be aware that all it takes is for someone to make the claim and you have to be put to the proof of saying no I do in each of these particular ways. And. I. Guess. I'm. Going. To the, future. Of IR regulation all, this is quite seems, to be quite, rigid. And quite hard to move, around it, an environment. Which doesn't, really promote, flexible. Working with, through the economy well, there. Will be a number of responses. In. Terms, of how, we characterize this, there, might be some future future movements. To expand. The. Way we can in, flexibly, engage people, so, there. Are there. Are some.
People Saying we should expand. The. Way individual, flexibility, arrangements, work so individual, flexibility, arrangements, allow people to. Make. Requests, and pursuant. To agreements, where, which are reduced to writing to change working hours, to. You. Know change. The way overtime rates were only rights work allowances. And leave loading, and we might see in the future that there's. A lot more flexibility, in in that sense because it's, driven by people who want to work in different ways as you're referred to so you really need to. The law needs to be able to allow. That to happen without people falling, afoul of to, quite rigid provisions, and. What I'd like to see possibly. And what some people have said is more, certainty in the regulation, of independent, contracting, so I think that really gets at the heart of what we're talking about if, we did if. We could point to something and say that's independent, contracting, and the law says, that it's independent contracting we'd, be able to move forward without been worried about it I think it's ridiculous, that in 2018, someone, came to me and said I'm, thinking about engaging science, a particular way can, you tell me the answer we. At, the end of it would say. It. Is far. More likely than not that it's this well, that we. Won't know until the court tells us well, so. You. Know we'll. Obviously apply the latest legal tests, we'll give you the best legal advice that we can give you but we don't know whether we're right or not 100%. Yeah, it's probably a nineteen eighty. Percent, court so. I'd like to see that and. I'd. Like to see a. Little. Bit more of a. Legal. Framework which, accepts, these very. Present, and operating, businesses, I don't. Want to see companies. Doing the wrong thing judging. People in the wrong ways but I'd like to see it being. Reflected, in a framework that we could live with do you think there's going to be two different types of legislation once, than what we would traditionally know, is like a wage an hourly worker, versus. A salary, worker which is where the high knowledge workers, tend to colleges, so you can engage people on salary. Basis if. You, if you conduct, calculations. That reflect. That. You. Know in no way will you fall afoul of any, industrial, instrument that would otherwise apply, more than actually, does apply yeah and that you have a set off Clause within the contract that says we're, able to do this and if there's anything that.
We've, Missed on a pay period to pay period basis it's set off against the salary that we've, had bit more, so. You can do that with with alling hourly, rates so you could do that with salary. Again. One, of the other questions that we got was. Will I. Think. You know how. The contracts, for services vary from fixed term contracts, so, someone. Here is thinking about well. If. I'm just getting somebody in for a particular task, I'll get them in on fixed term contract, that might be an easier way they, definitely won't be a contractor, I could just pay them in that way well. I. Guess. A contract, for services is your contractor. Arrangement. And it's, important you get their characterization right, on the, other side a fixed term contractor, is a very particular type, of employment relationship, you don't want to get that wrong either because. Hasn't there being some legal. Developments. There as well yes there has and. And we've been involved in that as a third acting. For some, of those I will for one of those parties but the, risk in any fixed term contract, is that we have. You. Know we understand, that whether it's a maximum term contract, or you, know a true fixed term contract, so on the one side of things we can actually terminate, it when we when, we need to terminate it. For. Cause and, then the other side we're actually fixed, to a period of time we can't touch it so, people, need to be aware and get the appropriate legal advice about, you. Know whether a fixed term contract is appropriate, and all of their circumstance. And. It's sounding. Like there, really does need to be as we say changes, here to make things. In. Terms of their task you can you can get that. If. You, engage with someone once to, do a particular task I think it's probably a low-risk, man if, you repeatedly engage, someone through the app again it's, better than if you start engaging them, you, know directly, records, um but, but, I would I would, certainly. Not discourage people from using the, gig economy I think it's a fantastic thing but, just, do it through the platforms, that allow peer-to-peer, connection. If. You're if you were over you or delivery, or Fedora you, have to think about how you set yourselves up to perform that through the app. But if you're a business you should use air, Tasker, you should use over, to move people around if you wish of course you should but, just if you repeatedly engage the same person, and and, avoid. Directly, engaging them then I think we need to you need to be careful yes. We. Have actually had a question Michael but, what about the implications. Of the word pact. Versus. Key in case. Different. Kind, of different that I mean you know in. The sense that you're actually talking employees, there rather than. Contractors. But yeah yeah, again. It's it's it's further, shed, doubt on what what, a casual, employment, employer is employee, is. Everyone's. Still working through what. That means and. I think if there. Are a large. Number of businesses, that engage people, on a casual basis whether, we engage people in a regular and systematic basis. Is kind of you, know what we need to start thinking about the. True the true type of casual employer II is, somebody, who who. Works on an ad hoc basis, comes in when it's necessary, their engagement ends when the shift ends, the, problem is when, somebody is engaged for, weeks and months at a time on a set. Roster, and they know that they're going to come in and know that the, amount of money they're going to receive etc. So I think if you have particular, questions about, that case particular, questions about your business it's. Important, I think you can contact if you're a Chamber member or an HR advance person. To. Contact the our, workplace advice to hear and get theirs and they say take advice about that specific, situation, just. Not one more question around the is. It's more crystal ball gazing I, suppose but. There. Has been some suggestions, that are. That. On, the Union side that they'll be pursuing. Some new, definition, of worker, so that yeah that. To. Try, and pull back these gig economy, workers, into a more, traditional way, of. Classifying. Please if you got any comments. On that I, think, I think all of that will work it its, way, through and of course. Unions, have their own particular views. On what the future of IR regulation, looks like I. Think. I think everyone wants to get a settled, view on this, and. I think all of this will reveal itself in the fullness of time I think if, we're engaging people through the gig economy. You. Know through air Tasker, we're not engaging people in a casual basis so we can we can put, that to one side, but. Certainly. The, traditional. Types of engagements. Are changing, and they're changing quite fast right now. Absolutely. Well. And, anything, further from you know. Really. The message to take away from from, today because.
Yeah Things are progressing so. Thank you to my HR advance community for listening today, hope. You gained some useful understanding, of what the gig economy means. To your business if. You do have any further questions, you can contact me, at customer. Service at HR, advanced cantata, you and as, always the, HR advance platform, is there to assist you in managing your HR work, don't, forget HR. Nonsubscribers do, have access to the workplace and vise line it's free, to premium subscribers, so if you have particular HR, questions, then do contact, them, keep. An eye on your newsletter for, details, of our webinar for next month and at. The end of today's presentation you, will receive an email with the video so you can revisit today's. Presentation. At any time thanks. Again for listening.