JUMP.V: Interview with Mitchell Geisler, CEO (Leveljump Healthcare)

JUMP.V: Interview with Mitchell Geisler, CEO (Leveljump Healthcare)

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hi everyone welcome on money i am mark and today  i will talk about leverljump healthcare a company   focused on revenue growth and new opportunities  within healthcare and to talk about the company   i will talk with mitchell geisler ceo of the  company how are you michelle i'm doing well mark   thanks for having me here today it's always great  to have an opportunity to talk about the company   and happy new year to everybody as we get ready to  start a great new year for us here at level jump   yeah for sure it's like my first interview of  the year and you know like i'm very excited to   to talk with uh talk about level jump um so could  you stay could you tell us more about the company   what's the story behind leverage of healthcare  yeah absolutely so level jump healthcare uh you   know we originally started with uh cts which are  our current operations it's called uh canadian   teleradiology services and when we started a  healthcare company years ago we wanted to be   involved in healthcare for a number of reasons um  obviously we'd like that you know you're helping   people reaching out to people uh and the meaning  what that means to it because i i just think you   want to do something that's fulfilling and you  know makes you feel whole as a person it's not   just about making money of course shareholders  at the end of the day we all want to make money   but but that's that's the result at the end of a  journey of a long journey so we were interested   in healthcare at the time we were interested in  medical imaging and how it pertains to radiology   mris ultrasounds whether it was having these  centers or having some kind of service involved   in the business we were interested in in radiology  because it what we realized as we were studying   and kind of investigating the direction we  wanted to go in is that radiology diagnostic   imaging is the core focus one of the staples of  the healthcare system if you will when people   go into uh emergency room or the hospital a lot of  times they have to have an x-ray or an ultrasound   when they uh have an issue you go to your doctor  and you say oh my back's hurting my neck is   hurting you know i don't feel right uh certainly  a lot of diseases everything is always detected   through imaging so we started to realize okay not  only is it rewarding and it gives gives back and   we're doing something purposeful but on the on  the business opportunity side we have a lot of   opportunity here it's not going to go somewhere  it's something that is really a staple a core   of health care it's something that's going to be  recession proof so we started you know venturing   out as to what we could do and uh we came across  this company cts and we purchased it back in   2009 and uh we've been operating and growing it  uh ever since along with some other healthcare   ventures and about i guess a year and a half ago  now we said hey we have cts it's a growing company   we think we can go to the market and then we can  really expand our focus from there and that's   how we kind of get to the inception of level jump  healthcare if you will and we said okay obviously   our core to this date has been radiology services  but what else can we do and we started to look at   the entire telehealth market certainly coming uh  you know at that time we were in the midst of the   start of the pandemic uh maybe just a few  months into it we thought we've seen all   these telehealth companies we're like wait we've  been doing telehealth companies cts since 2000   you know in five we've been running it since  2009. so we're already kind of like experts   we understand this marketplace really well so  we said this is an interesting story we think   to bring to the marketplace where we could  take the telehealth and grow so you know your   our mission is focused it massaged a little bit  over you know as we became public and look at that   and and looking forward and now we're really  focused on becoming an services company based   on providing telehealth services uh to remote  communities urban centers wherever they're needed   primarily in radiology but now we're trying  to expand that into other services as well   okay so we will talk about your acquisitions you  did uh later in the interview but first because   you're talking about the business and the market  so what's the the business model for radiology   and how big is the market yeah so for the core  functions that we have to data of the radiology   um you know the the market that the flow is great  to basically a flow of funds like right now we   service the ontario marketplace excuse me and  we deal with uh the insurance provider which is   the government in ontario uh so we have a really  good flow of funds which is great we don't really   run a lot of accounts uh receivable they get  paid all within like 60 days generally speaking   so we always have the flow coming in of money  which is really important as a public company   that you can count on and shareholders can  rely on but taking a step back and looking at   like cts we're one of the leaders right now in  in ontario in the country we service you know   nearly a few dozen hospitals we have dozens of  radiologists that work for us uh we've kind of   entrenched our name and we continue to grow and  add more con contracts the beautiful thing about   telehealth and in this case teleradiology is  that it can be done from anywhere oh yeah for   sure yeah yeah so as we've uh invested resources  you know particularly in the last year and that   we're able to start looking at expanding not  not just in other parts of canada but we can   go into other markets as well and there's  a lot of under serviced areas uh you know   whether you're talking about  caribbean islands you're talking about southeast asia you know certain countries  where they want either canadian or u.s   board certified radiologists where they want  access to these services so we really see it   you know the market size i i know right now it's  like about 26 billion dollars the tele radiology   market and it continues to grow each year you  know the reality is it's choppy and we're here   and we believe like we're setting ourselves up  for long-term success that we can expand and   again because it's remote and because our doctors  our radiologists are the ones that are in demand   we really like um the world is your oyster in a  sense right you know we have a lot of opportunity   you can't do it all overnight uh you can't just  go into this country in that country you know one   time we have to have some infrastructure and what  but uh when it's not brick and mortar it's a lot   easier to supply that services so we really think  we have a great opportunity here okay and so when   you're talking about opportunities so i guess  might be passing by growth and so on first just   like the big picture what's your growth strategy  because you you have acquisitions incoming so   what's yeah what's the big picture out of it yeah  so for level jump the growth strategy is twofold   one obviously is always organic growth um you  know we wanna cts can continue to grow as we've   discussed there's no end to that additionally  you know what you said we're going to get into   the acquisitions but we've announced some  and we think the acquisitions are important   uh they're important uh for us to grow rapidly  they're important for us to entrench ourselves   in other areas of telehealth or of diagnostic  imaging in the case of some of our acquisitions   so when we bring it all together it's both  organic and acquisition but when we acquire   a company we want to say how can that does that  have organic growth to it as well right how can   we grow that so that the pie just keeps getting  bigger and bigger and i think when you look at the   telehealth market it's really still in its infancy  you know it's really yes healthcare obviously has   been around forever but the idea of telehealth  is still relatively new and what we've seen   uh coming into out of the pandemic although right  now in lockdown i'm not sure out of it but as   we progressed through it is that um  healthcare officials administrators   government officials everybody is really taking  on to telehealth uh from that perspective which   is great in the states you've seen we've seen  medicare codes change to allow for telehealth   uh here in ontario they're allowing doctors to do  you know your gp can can do a call with you and   get paid for it where before they couldn't okay so  some of these things they may not affect cts today   but it's changing the dialogue right it's  changing the view of how everybody sees things   and on the patient side people are used to  this so it's just becoming bigger and bigger   and we believe as level jump a company that  you know our operations are cash flow positive   that you know we've been around and proven our  model that we've set ourselves up that when the   the dust settles from this kind of infancy  for telehealth that level job is going to be   a company that's going to be there and growing  for a long time to come and for sure it is   different interesting because you know like on  a personal way i would have never thought that   i could see a doctor using uh tele health and  like i always thought i would i would have to   see like a doctor like in real and the fact that  you have all these opportunities in coming it's so   much easier for us for the person that need like a  doctor or anything and also look for the companies   and for sure it's a huge place and there is a  high growth opportunity yeah and everybody's   just taking on to it now right like two years ago  most people wouldn't have thought about talking to   their doctor on their own or something like that  and again we may not be doing that specific thing   right now but it's just the greater the acceptance  the greater uh inclusion it becomes and everybody   starts adopting these services and then they take  more interest in what we're doing and so because   right now we're talking about telehealth could  you talk about the acquisition you you are doing   about tele hospital what revenues you expect  from them why is it a smart acquisition for you   yeah absolutely yeah we're really excited  about the telehotel hospital acquisition so   it's a company down in the midwest in the  united states and its founders they uh establish   this company what i really like is the code is how  similar it is to cts they established it because   they're in uh the main city in the state and what  they realized was in the rest of the state uh it   was under service there wasn't enough services  now here at cts we specialize in small urban   and rural communities right so these communities  that don't have enough radiologists to do reading   they then the patients goes to the emergency  room department uh they have their ct or their   ultrasound their mri whatever it is they need  they're able to then call our doctors to do the   interpretation so we're making sure under service  areas have services that you or i would expect in   a big city like a montreal toronto uh new york  wherever you may be they've done the same thing   at telehospital they've now gone in and they've  said okay but not just for they're not they're   not in radiology they're in everything else so  they're going out to small rural communities and   they could be small community hospitals they could  be urgent care centers if it's a really small town   but small and small and small really adds  up over time when you put it all together   and they're providing emergency room doctor  services remotely they're providing uh consults   for full appointments with neurologists urologists  uh pain specialists as to treatment plans of what   you can do they've really taken kind of like what  we're doing with radiology but they're doing it   for everything so these patients they go to their  hospital or to the urgent care center the doctor   there isn't the specialist isn't the type of  doctor that can give them all the care they need   they then can video chat with the doctor you're  with in the small town get the specialists on   the video and have a proper consult and then  you're still getting that same care that you need   and what's wonderful about that is they've  really grown the company uh they should   did for 2021 around uh 6 million u.s so you  know closer to eight million canadian because   our numbers and that we report for level jump are  canadian uh but about six million u.s with about   800 to as much as a million in ebitda and  they're rapidly growing like they've been growing   like crazy over the last few years so we  really see like them getting up to eight   to 10 million revenue this year with over a  million dollars yeah and going from there and   when we found them uh what they liked about  us is is myself and our management team we   had experience both in canada and we've been in  the in the u.s marketplace before they liked the  

fact that level jump was public on on the tsxv  and trades you know it's dtc eligible and trades   obviously down in the united states as well so  they liked all the facets that we had the primary   physician who started it is actually going to  stay on and he's going to continue to run it and   he wanted our business he wanted our business  expertise to say hey how do we expand it from   here right how do i go into other states you know  how do we go from 10 million to 40 million that's   what over the next few years that's what he wants  to do because he wasn't sure he's you know how to   kind of manage that happening so we really think  there's a lot of cohesion there the impact on the   numbers i suggested to level jump is obvious  you know if if we could do eight nine million   or more us this year and have a million u.s  dollars of ebitda obviously like cts that means   cash flow positive operations falling to the  bottom line you know making sure we're positive   revenue company uh going forward so we think that  there's a lot of opportunity there as a side note   what's interesting they offer literally about 20  30 different types of doctors and services the   only thing they don't offer is radiology services  and all their sites need both are matching nearly   all right yeah so he so they're like oh this is  great can you also then can we start offering   radiology services and we we're familiar with  the us marketplace already we're like yeah we   absolutely can we have doctors that are licensed  we can get them licensed in your state and uh and   we can so we just think there's all kinds of  synergies and it's just a perfect acquisition   and going back to what we talked about our  mission of becoming not just radiology focus but   telehealth focus this really encompasses it all  and uh and that's why we think that it's you know   it's just going to be really good for level jump  which ultimately will be good for our shareholders   well sure no it is different this morning you  know as we were saying like the numbers you are   projecting for 2022 they are not like drawn like  somewhere you know like impossible to reach as   like as you say like you have the market you have  all the the technologies for so this is definitely   interesting and so you also plan to to acquire  your real-time medical and insurance and show   vision you you took stakes recently in them so  could you discuss could you develop about them   yeah we absolutely can so we have uh real-time  medical is basically a competitor to cts they also   supply remote radiology services and we you know  wanted to we thought there's like obvious obvious   synergies there obviously you know it made sense  uh so we just had an opportunity that came in   front of us to buy out some of their shareholders  uh so we have done that there's been a lot of   announcements uh we're up to uh penning certain  approvals as much as uh i think just under 25   or 27 percent now of real time and we're hoping to  acquire more as as the year proceeds you know so   those talks continue but obviously you know as we  get up to a sizable position there will be a lot   of a lot of synergies there and would you know  make us one of the larger the the largest tele   radiology play in in canada you know and really  set us up to expand beyond canada and to other   markets like we were talking about earlier so it's  a great opportunity for us and i think you know   for for the fact that we were doing it uh to date  most of what we've done has all been a share swap   uh preserving cash has been great so it's just  really exciting to you know kind of have that   vision and be able to see it kind of starting  to come to fruition okay sorry yeah no it's   going to say and then on the uh on the shaw lens  jawline's is it's a little bit different it's   uh obviously still in healthcare and it but it's  not you know it's not in telehealth or radiology   but it's an opportunity that uh was before myself  and and uh and our management team and we loved   the product so much and believe in its potential  that we said it's something that should be you   know within level job and then we'll see where  we go from there and what they do is they have a   product on the market that uh it treats  a condition for people who wear glasses   called anisoconia which is when you people who  wear glasses when they're looking through their   left and right eye and how it signals back to the  brain of what it is you're seeing yet there's a   time delay and that creates a lot of pain such  as dizziness neck pain back pain uh nausea tired   eyes sleepy eyes all these things because you're  always straining and your brain is thinking at   different speed they created a patented technology  when the doctor measures uh takes your your um   your measurements for your lenses they take  some additional measurements they put it into   their software and the lens is cut a little bit  differently so when you get your glasses it takes   about a day or two to get used to but then after  that people who put it on they never want to take   it off because it really exposes a lot a lot of  issues so we just believe that this company offers   a lot of opportunity so we're going to continue  to try and acquire more of the company because   you know if it's if it's as big as we think  it can ultimately it'll benefit the level jump   shareholders so looking forward to that you know  and that and that just uh just one thing reminds   me uh even though you know we're a lot of services  company they have a patented technology at shaw   lands and uh going back to the tele hospital they  actually have a few patented technologies as well   okay so while we we're not primarily a technology  company it's certainly great as we go forward as   a telehealth company that we're acquiring you know  technologies that are unique and and could bring a   lot of big bang if you will to to the company okay  at the bachelor lens are they canadian or american   they're canadian uh their patent is a  u.s patent but they're they're canadian   okay okay i see and um i was wondering  um because you know so for um   the first company we're talking about about  italian hospital you are acquiring a hundred   percent uh directly so why didn't you do  this as well for a real-time insurance just kind of the mechanics of where those  companies are what they're ready to sell at   this time and you know and how that gets done so  it's not obviously we want to acquire more as i've   alluded to so we'll continue to focus on that um  you know and don't don't forget in addition to uh   the tele hospital and real time and course shall  lends that we have the acquisition of our ihfs   which are the independent healthcare facilities  uh east of toronto that we're acquiring and those   ones we've announced we have the financing uh  in place got great terms with uh td bank uh td   canada trust uh loan which is always great to have  a you know a big bank behind you with proper loans   you know a 10-year loan at less than four percent  so that's fantastic so okay we're looking forward   we've announced that we've got ministry approval  on one of the three centers we're acquiring uh so   we think uh that that'll close uh hoping the end  of this month that i don't know if with everything   going on it could get delayed a couple weeks but  hopefully later this month that that's going to   close uh you know so that also is going to come  under the fold you know when you start looking at   you know where level jump is today and where  it might be in six months from now it could be   vastly different okay you know it was just out of  curiosity because i saw they were like i would say   sort of like two different type of acquisitions  so i was just curious like on the stretch strategy   you were doing yeah it's it's just sometimes it's  just what you can acquire so it's you know how   many what are the what are the selling parties  willing to sell that's all okay some people want   out some people aren't ready to get out you know  you know different terms so that's all okay and so   you are doing so to acquire this company you you  gain warrants and shares so right now you have am   88 sorry you didn't cheerfully debuted what would  you be your target or your maximum if you have one   of shares that we would have  outstanding yeah in the future   um never thought of it that way i think  we we don't look at it that way i think a   smart management team you look at it what is  it you're getting for the share right so like   uh people who are watching this when you see a  company just issue shares like i don't know to   somebody for promotion or something which  they're not supposed to do anyways but you   know depends where they are what jurisdiction  but that's not really getting you anything   right but like if we're issuing shares because  we're getting ownership in real time or sha   or if uh you know in the past if we've done a  financing or in the future if we do a financing   and then we take that money not to put it into  promotion to put that money into acquisitions   creating generating more revenue streams creating  more positive cash flow then that's what matters   and then the rest source itself out so i think  the real question is or the real answer is   when you are issuing shares what is the value the  company is getting that is in the best interest of   all the shareholders of level jump that and that's  the question so you know we're obviously cognizant   i'd rather not have you know you know you'd rather  have less shareholders outstanding but again   if it's if you're issuing shares to get a piece of  a pie that's fantastic that benefits the company   which benefits the shareholders and that's  that makes sense too then we go to the board   and we discuss it okay so perfect answer then  and so because you're talking about you know   the shares um and we are talking about this year  so uh if you are checking leverage on healthcare   right now you are you have only a 8 million  market cap um would you say it's like the fair   evaluation regarding all the potential of the  first the company and then of the market and   i i was thinking i couldn't find any comparables  to level jim so could you give us some numbers out   of it or uh yeah um well they already comment on  specific numbers i mean what i i think our market   cap is uh crazy low um you know the idea of us  being trading at barely above one times revenue   uh when our offer from an operational standpoint  is cash flow positive uh you know as we mentioned   before you know we have great ar flow uh of cash  coming in we provide our services we're generating   revenue literally 365 days a year there's no  day that we don't generate revenue with our   client hospital so before we even get into the  acquisitions just looking at the cts operations   and where we are um you know i i think that being  at only an eight million dollar market cap is   is extremely low uh i think right now of course  you know the market dictates and certainly   i think uh some a lot of the telehealth uh stocks  have fallen uh in in the last bunch of months   you know as people they've gone into bitcoin  or you know whatever the thing of the day is   so i would speak to a long-term shareholder and i  think if you're a long-term shareholder you want   to look at the fundamentals so the fundamentals  is we have a company that's uh been around for   a long time with a proven model um that we have  operations or cash flow positive that management   has been around there's no management changes or  anything like that we just keep on doing our thing   and then you start saying okay but what's the  company going to do that's all great mitch but   what are we going to do well we've announced all  these acquisitions we've announced financing plan   for some of it already in place uh we're still  able even with where the stock trade is able   to do certain share swaps to gain um more uh  ownership of of our competitor of shawlins as   we've mentioned um so you know when i think when  you focus in the current operations and what   we're executing right now and showing to everybody  if you're a long-term shareholder it's a great   time to come into our stock yeah you know and  and yeah you always want you know people look uh   you know people know in in the general  telehealth terms whether it's uh   it's a new path utopia doc well uh you know  skylight all these stocks that i'm sure a   lot of your listeners have have watched  over the last 18 months and go like this   sometimes they announce acquisitions but they're  not profitable acquisitions right or you know and   they pay it a lot or what have you and it's  kind of like okay where are they going to go   when you and you don't want to be buying  their stock at as high you want everybody   said oh if only i bought it when it was at its low  before the pandemic or something like that right   so if you believe in what i've said about our  core businesses being staple of the importance   of healthcare believing in us and our management  team and our acquisitions we've announced   um there's not much slow for the stock to go  down but there's a lot of opportunity for the   stock to go up and i think fundamentally speaking  everybody has their own system how they might   put a value on a company but i think it would be  hard for us to say the value is only eight million   so i think it makes a great opportunity for  you know people to take a look at our stock   you know when i'm looking at a company and  i'm checking the valuation i was looking at   the prices ratio and when i saw how low the ratio  was for level but first i couldn't believe it and   you i'm talking with other investors and it's the  same they are saying they're like level jump is a   sleeping giant and the yeah but you know it's like  it's you just like talking about the fundamentals   uh they're wider valued compared to to the  sector and the fact that you your company and   the management board decided to acquire to do all  these smart acquisitions for sure for a long-term   shell holder on the upside is gonna should be huge  at least and so if we're talking about long-term   um and for the shareholders where would you  see the company in in five years for example   uh you know our goal is you know first goal  is get to 20 million you know this year   for 2021 you know we don't have the final numbers  but we know they're over six and a half million   we'll see where the fourth quarter uh lands us  between six and a half and seven million but   and with the acquisitions we've announced  you know we want to get to 20 million   from 20 million it's really to 50 million  and from 50 to 100 and you keep going and   the thing is is that as we acquire and get  bigger and because we're so focused on acquiring   companies that are also have cash flow our cash  flow positive and have positive ebitda we'll get   into a position where as we get bigger we'll be  able to fund our further acquisitions ourselves   right you know and we already have a relationship  with the bank so i think you know when you're   looking over the next five years and you say  can this be a 125 plus million dollar company   we can't i mean we have to execute you know we  have to do a lot of a lot of work but i think   we've laid the groundwork to get there and that  we have a logical proper path uh to get there   like it makes sense you can see our acquisitions  unfolding you can see how we're going to grow them   organically and then find other acquisitions  that fit within our mold and all come together   um okay so if you're a long-term shareholder  this is the company that you you like to jump   into like for sure and you're like we talked a  lot about the company uh about the the growth   the fundamental the future but like just  to know like more about you because um   you are the ceo since 2010 right yes and so it's  been a long time you are into the jump project so   what what is the motivation to that is  driving you to lead like the whole project   my motivation is uh threefold my motivation  is to i'm j i've been a business guy i've been   in some different industries i i was in in  mining for a while i've been around building   gold mines uh i've been in the hospitality  sector i've been in different industries i've   always been an operations guy and tried to  have vision so my three targets are to build   a company as i mentioned i liked healthcare  because of its benefits and what it offers i like   the fact that we're helping rural communities  uh and our acquisitions are all about rural   communities as well so i like that vision but the  target is build a successful telehealth company um   you know we have time but make sure that we have  strong fundamentals that we can get to the targets   that we've talked about on a daily basis i love  the fact that we employ people and it's dependable   income i like the fact that you know when you i  kind of value that relationship of when you have   people working for you that they can depend  on that income you know that they have can put   food on their table and that and there's a lot of  benefit you know uh aside from growing the company   there's a lot of interaction with all your staff  and people on a kind of human level each day and   i get a lot of benefit out of that and i think  that's really important because if you focus   on all these things the rest will take care of  itself so you know i want to build a company i   want to give back by you know as we expand we can  hire more people create jobs i think that's good   for the economy i think that's a sense a personal  kind of uh fulfillment if you will a professional   fulfillment that i have and then thirdly i think  if we take care of those things the company will   be successful not just build a company but  build a successful company and if we do that   then the stock will be great and everybody will  make money so if you're a long-term shareholder   like i'm a long-term shareholder then we'll all  make money together you know down down the road   uh you know and that that that's what we want to  do so you know that the stock it may be where it   is today but who's to say you know in x amount of  time it won't be at a dollar forty or two dollars   and eighty cents or you know six dollars so you  know let's just keep building it together and then   and and hopefully we can return shareholder wealth  to everybody all right well perfect thank you for   for everything uh you know it was very interesting  to to start the new year with level jump because   the company has like you know i would say so  much potential so it was very interesting uh a   lot of person asked me to to do this interview  because they wanted to know more to discover   more about the company so thank you for your  time i really appreciate it and i'm excited   to see where the company will be in the future  that's great thank you very much mark appreciate   the opportunity today to talk to you and  your listeners thank you have a great day

2022-01-13 22:59

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